User talk:Force Fire/Archive 12: Difference between revisions

User talk:Force Fire/Archive 12 (view source)

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 == Another quick Q ==
-Should Pokémon in the [[Undiscovered Egg Group|Undiscovered]] or [[Ditto Egg Group|Ditto Egg Groups]] have a "by [[breeding]]" section in their Learnset section? Because, in my opinion, if they can't breed, then should they have this:
+Should Pokémon in the [[No Eggs Discovered (Egg Group)|Undiscovered]] or [[Ditto (Egg Group)|Ditto Egg Groups]] have a "by [[breeding]]" section in their Learnset section? Because, in my opinion, if they can't breed, then should they have this:
 ====by {{pkmn|breeding}}====
 {{learnlist/breedh/8|Victini|Psychic|Fire|5}}
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 ::::I don’t think it’s important if it is never used.[[User:Pikablu|Pikablu]] ([[User talk:Pikablu|talk]]) 19:23, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
 :::::The entire point of the stones is one of Chloe's main arcs in this series: what evolution will Eevee take, its clear if more than one episode has her obtain an Eevee evolution item, it is teasing a possible new evolution of Eevee in the series. I agree with Hikaru to add Chloe obtaining stones. Also, do you even have a source about the writers? [[User:Noelephant213|Noelephant213]] ([[User talk:Noelephant213|talk]]) 19:54, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
+{{indent}}I don't think whether she'll use it or not is justification on whether to put it in the major events section or not, Ash received a Fast ball from Kurt and never used it, yet we still list it as a major event. I think it's fine if it's an important item, not like she was given a potion or anything, she was given an evolutionary stone. As for going to another region or catching a new Pokémon, those are fine. Anything else isn't notable, even if she is treated more important, she's still a supporting character, and is still listed as such on the official site.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 07:54, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
+::Okay, but if an event relevant to a "supporting character" happens why should that information be omitted? In the end this is what I said about character building and no one answered anything. For example, Cynthia had a whole character building throughout the anime to get to the battle she's going to have against Ash, Chloe until episode 50 we didn't even know if she would be a trainer or not, now she is a trainer that is being built a story arc for her and we come back to the same discussion. I personally think Eevee won't even evolve, mainly because it's supposed to become a Gigantamax Eevee, but something is being done for Chloe and there's no point in ignoring it. By the way, even though Chloe is not a main character, she occupies the position of the "Poké Girl" of the current generation, that's a fact. --[[User:Hikaru Wazana|Hikaru Wazana]] ([[User talk:Hikaru Wazana|talk]]) 15:30, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
+:::I still don't understand why Chloe is not listed under encountering Cresselia in [[JN074]], it feels off putting to pretend she was not in that situation with Dawn. There are examples of non main characters having major events listed about them, an example being in [[JN090]] where Faba learning that Kukui is the Masked Royal is listed, yet Faba has appeared in far less significance than Chloe. Is there a link on the official site that Chloe is a supporting character? I'm not disagreeing I just can't seem to find it... [[User:Noelephant213|Noelephant213]] ([[User talk:Noelephant213|talk]]) 19:06, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
+:::::If I'm correct, this comes from the official website on TV Tokyo. The problem with using this page as source is that it is not updated frequently, including some broken links. And yes, this Faba example is one more point. Although the anime is still Ash's story, it's been several years since it's just "Ash's anime". It's even cool, because it shows that it's a universe with a life of its own and it shows that the characters have a life of their own when they're not with Ash.--[[User:Hikaru Wazana|Hikaru Wazana]] ([[User talk:Hikaru Wazana|talk]]) 20:00, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
+::::::Oh ok, got it. That's interesting to bring up especially since Chloe is listed ahead of Team Rocket on the site [[User:Noelephant213|Noelephant213]] ([[User talk:Noelephant213|talk]]) 01:59, 21 February 2022 (UTC)
 == Suggestions ==
@@ Line 854: / Line 860: @@
 [[User:Oneofthosedf|Oneofthosedf]] ([[User talk:Oneofthosedf|talk]]) 20:50, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
+:Could I at least get an answer? Or could you redirect me to a person who can help me with the process?
+:    '''[[User:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#D64933">Oneofthosedf</span>]] [[User talk:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#2877AC">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#64B823">(contribs)</span>]] 15:52, 24 February 2022 (UTC)
+::Apologies for the late response. I'll briefly go over your points. Point 1 and 4 seem to go hand in hand, I wouldn't mind using the sugimori artwork in favor of the menusprites for single image templates. Using them for a list makes the template look larger than it needs to be, so menusprites (being smaller) works better imo. As for the types, the older ones are preferred because the text is larger than those on the newer symbols. The new symbol may look nicer but it doesn't help those unaware of what those smbol represents.
+::For points 2 and 3, Maahirmomtaz is in the wrong here. I have no idea why they are making those edits and someone should ask them why on their talk page. If they doesn't respond, then staff can make them respond. Using the sup template for game specific moves is indeed how we do things. Though I do agree that it has recently gotten ridiculous, and your templates are indeed a better way of showing them. I don't think having both games and generations in one header would be confusing, as long as the reader understands the purpose of such layout.
+::For point 5, I'm 50/50 on it. I think they should be separated for being completely different learning methods, but I can understand merging them to save space.
+::As for the galleries, eh. We don't do that for voice actor articles, so I don't think it's worth doing it for the designer articles. Just bloats the article up, imo.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 07:29, 1 March 2022 (UTC)
+:::Thank you for the response. I hope I didn't come off as arrogant, but I'm just used to sending a reminder to offices IRL. There was no frustration behind it.
+:::The two points that I care about most are #3 and #5, the ones that would require the most work and the ones that are most needed. I'll address all of them one by one briefly.
+:::'''1:''' I just think the different line heights look pretty jarring. Consistency is always the best, and considering we can fix all the templates that use menusprites this easily, it should be done. I do dislike that all of them need to be 68x68, but that's life. Nothing we can do about that (unless of course we move away from pixel art, which gives us endless sclability options).
+:::'''2&3:''' I think they noticed the situation getting ridiculous as well. If my suggestions are accepted, we would only need to use the superscripts for the few forms and new Pokémon that were introduced in Pt, B2W2, ORAS and USUM. I trust the reader will understand it. But we can always leave a note in the footer explaining that Gen VII and Gen VIII needed to be broken up.
+:::'''4:''' I think the era of menusprites is over. We'll inevitably get confirmation in a few months when the SV trailers start to showcase some gameplay. But neither BDSP nor LA uses them anymore. I think it's done. Consistency is always the best move, and a core quality of Bulbapedia. I love the spritework personally, but they don't look as good on the Switch as they do on Bulbapedia. We can't keep using menusprites and the LA headshots with whatever SV will introduce, then a possible fourth artstyle by the end of 2023. I understand the issue with the Sugimori artworks taking up too much place, but technically they wouldn't. There would be just less white spaces. I pray for a game where every Pokémon is available again (mainly for this reason), but until then the Sugimori artworks are the only thing every Pokémon has (Eiscue forms and Galarian Zen Darmanitan don't need to be incldued, thankfully). I also don't think they look bad, I can try making a longer list with 100+ Pokémon if that's something you think would be more convincing.
+:::'''4:''' As for the type bars, I'm not sure that I understand your complaint. I don't see why we'd need to use the ones from 2006. AFAIK the Fairy type bars are fan-made. My sandbox displays the version with the type names. They are perfectly legible, and the symbols aren't too small either. The colors broadly fit the colors Bulbapedia uses as well. We should move away from pixel art, because monitors with higher resolutions don't accommodate them too well. I need to zoom out a whole lot for them to look crisp. Ironically the type bars I am using are now obsolete as well, BDSP, LA and SV use a new version, so I shall implement those (though I'd need permission to remove the dead space around them).
+:::'''5:''' This is partly about future-proofing, partly about reducing bloat, and partly about displaying information as neatly as possible. I am certain we will get new learning/tutoring methods later down the line, and we don't need another section for Giga Drain with 300+ entries that contains the same information. It also addressed the issue with moves that keep going for TMs to tutors to TRs, then back to tutors, etc. I don't think it would be confusing at all.
+:::'''Galleries:''' I wouldn't want them to be used on voice actor pages either, utterly useless IMO. I think there is a stronger argument for displaying artworks on the pages of the designers. A list just feels lifeless, while a gallery feels respectful to the artists, and helps users understand their design philosophy.
+:::I want to get as much input from experienced users as possible. I really want these changes to accommodate everyone, since I think this is the way going forward and something no other big sites have. How should I go about gaining supporters for this? I refrained from writing individual community members as I feel that constitutes as spam. '''[[User:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#D64933">Oneofthosedf</span>]] [[User talk:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#2877AC">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#64B823">(contribs)</span>]]''' 12:57, 1 March 2022 (UTC)
+::::Your posts doesn't seem arrogant or confrontational at all. I can understand wanting to bump a discussion when an admin doesn't respond to it. If you want to reach out to more users but not spam multiple talk pages, you can always use the [[Editor's hub]] talk page. Though going to a staff member works just as well, as they will most likely relay the message onto the other staff members in the staff discord.
+::::1: Nothing we can do if the images are of varying sizes. We can't expand the smallest menusprite to be the same size as the largest menusprite.
+::::2/3: Seems we are in agreement on this. I don't mind separate columns within a generation for separate games.
+::::4: I was actually under the impression that the artwork would make the other cells have more whitespace than needed as opposed to menusprites, but checking now, doesn't seem to be the case. Probably is more ideal looking comparing the two again.
+::::4: As for the types, (if I remember correctly) that was what was mentioned as the reason for using the older type images in a staff chat. The text would appear too small in the size we would have them, as opposed to the older images where the text were essentially the image. It's probably fine for mobile, but not so much for desktop.
+::::5: Yeah, not entirely against reducing repeated information, so I won't be bother if we do decide to merge them together.
+::::Galleries: That's understandable. I think having the images be smaller would change my mind, just having them how it is on your page makes it seem cluttered.
+::::And just a couple points about your templates: I think leaving the tutor/tm/tr row white works best to avoid color clashes (using EP for IoA may or may not be confused with CT, unless there's not much of a difference in movesets), and leaving out games where the move isn't coded in makes sense (though I think a note in the footnote might be best to avoid confused users asking questions).--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 14:53, 2 March 2022 (UTC)
+:::::1: I was thinking about what we have on the [[Pokémon Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl]] page. The version-exclusive list already uses the Moveevtrytm template, so we'd only need to change the headers (I think). The images are not altered, only centered. I am not exactly sure which part of the code makes them appear this way, but you can't deny that it looks more cohesive.
+:::::4: Here is an image (https://imgur.com/n0czury) I want you to look at. I use 2560x1440 monitors and at default zoom, everything on Bulbapedia appears to me as it does in the bottom row. Amazing for artworks. So much detail. Terrible for spritework, unfortunately. In order to enjoy them, I need to use 80% zoom (the standard for smaller resolutions), which makes everything tiny. You can also compare the readability of the type bars on the image. Exact same font height. I think one can read both just fine. By completely getting rid of spritework, we now have a zoom-proof wiki. People who are hard of seeing can now freely zoom in without the fear of blurry pixelart. So my proposal actually accommodates readability, if you think about it. It also shows that we don't need to stick with 68px, we can go smaller, if we want to further reduce scrolling. Or we can use 70px on move pages, but go with 50px for the headers on Pokémon pages. Endless possibilities. It would need some manual work, since the naming conventions for menusprites and Sugimori artwork are different, but that's part of future-proofing.
+:::::Galleries: Okay, I'll make some variations. I just used the default Bulbapedia gallery, I'm fine with scaling down.
+:::::IoA is unfortunately completely unreadable on a white background, and since it's neither a game, neither a separate DLC, using the EP superscript is more accurate. We don't list the tutor locations on the move pages (not in this case), so it doesn't matter whether it's obvious that the tutors are available on the IoA or the CT. Anyone who has access to one of them, automatically can access the other. '''[[User:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#D64933">Oneofthosedf</span>]] [[User talk:Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#2877AC">(talk)</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Oneofthosedf|<span style="color:#64B823">(contribs)</span>]]''' 15:36, 2 March 2022 (UTC)
+== You hate Lighting Power,didnt you? ==
+The name change you reverted was more accurate than the name they brought up.
+You know,Força means Power,not Force--[[User:Leokids|Leokids (Splash!)]] ([[User talk:Leokids|talk]]) 12:43, 24 February 2022 (UTC)
+:Because Daniel Carrero speaks Portuguese according to his userpage, whereas you don't indicate that you do, thus I'm going to believe the one that says they speak Portuguese.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 13:34, 24 February 2022 (UTC)
+== New bot? ==
+Hello, should there be a new bot that automatically welcomes new users on their talk page using '''<nowiki>{{subst:Welcome}}</nowiki>''' template? &mdash; ''[[User:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:red">Pokémon</span>]][[Special:Contributions/PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:#4BDF1F">Fan</span>]][[User talk:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:teal">12345</span>]].'' 23:00, 24 February 2022 (UTC)
+:Not Force Fire but that shouldn't really be used until the user makes good-faith edits or an attempt to contribute to the wiki, if me doing that on SmashWiki taught me anything. Wouldn't wanna welcome a vandal. [[User:Awesomelink234|Awesomelink234]] ([[User talk:Awesomelink234|talk]]) 23:05, 24 February 2022 (UTC)
+== Gen IX ==
+Hello! can you please tell me why you deleted the gen 9 page? ----[[User:DHP613|<span style="color:#337AFF">'''D'''</span><span style="color:#337AFF">HP</span>]][[User talk:DHP613|<span style="color:#7E7E7E">'''6'''</span><span style="color:#7E7E7E">13</span>]] 15:00, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+:They didn't delete it, they moved it from their userspace to the mainspace. Here it is [[Generation IX]]. [[User:Kikugi|Kikugi]] ([[User talk:Kikugi|talk]]) 15:02, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+I am very sorry, I see now why they did it, thank you for informing me and have a great day :)  ----[[User:DHP613|<span style="color:#337AFF">'''D'''</span><span style="color:#337AFF">HP</span>]][[User talk:DHP613|<span style="color:#7E7E7E">'''6'''</span><span style="color:#7E7E7E">13</span>]] 15:05, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+== Apology ==
+I wanted to apologize. I was the one who created the "Bea (anime)" page. I didn't know that it required an admin approval to create these pages. I'm sorry if I seemed offensive and/or selfish for doing so without authorization/approval.
+[[User:HygorBH|HygorBH]] ([[User talk:HygorBH|talk]]) 16:54, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+== Can I create Scarlet and Violet color templates? ==
+I saw that [[Pokémon Scarlet and Violet]] have been announced. --[[User:SaturnMario|<font color="#034112">SaturnMario</font>]], [[User talk:SaturnMario|<font color="#078325">his talk</font>]] and [[Special:Contributions/SaturnMario|<font color="#83C192">his contributions</font>]] 22:13, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+:I think it's best to wait a litte longer until we get more information on the [[Pokémon Scarlet and Violet]] series. &mdash; ''[[User:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:red">Pokémon</span>]][[Special:Contributions/PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:#4BDF1F">Fan</span>]][[User talk:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:teal">12345</span>]].'' 22:15, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
+::SaturnMario, you are [[User talk:SaturnMario#Game colors|well aware]] that only staff can make color templates.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 07:41, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
+== Question ==
+When will I be able to put '''[[User:PokémonFan12345/Nugget Bridge (site)]]''' back in the mainspace? &mdash; ''[[User:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:red">Pokémon</span>]][[Special:Contributions/PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:#4BDF1F">Fan</span>]][[User talk:PokémonFan12345|<span style="color:teal">12345</span>]].'' 16:37, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
+:When the editorial board feels that the site is notable.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 07:29, 1 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Urshifu ==
+Both forms of {{p|Urshifu}} have the same Base Stats, so should we do the same thing we did for the Regional Variants who had the same Base Stats as their normal variants? <small>- ''totally signed comment from [[User:Kirbychu Showdown|Kirbychu Showdown]] ([[User talk:Kirbychu Showdown|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Kirbych_Showdown|contribs]])'' </small> 21:55, 28 February 2022 (UTC) P.S. I also noticed you didn't respond to my other posts. Why?
+:Sure.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 07:29, 1 March 2022 (UTC)
+{{tt|Okay, the change has been made.|Why didn't I reply when I made the edit, this desynchronizes the time of the page edit and this reply}} {{unsigned|Kirbychu Showdown}}
+:“Why didn't I reply when I made the edit, this desynchronizes the time of the page edit and this reply” &mdash; That's completely fine, I don't care about the desync. --'''''[[User:Bfdifan2006|<font color="turquoise">Bfdifan2006</font>]]''''' <sub>([[User talk:Bfdifan2006|<font color="lime">T</font>]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bfdifan2006|<font color="orange">C</font>]])</sub> 20:32, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+== [[Calem|Calem's]] Age ==
+I've opened a new discussion on [[Talk:Calem (game)#Age|Calem's talk page]] as I noticed some back and forth about Calem's age and it's beginning to look like an edit war. I did not want to make any further edits as to contribute to the revert conflict. [[User:Landfish7|<span style="font-family:Tahoma;background:black"><font color="red">'''Land'''</font>]][[User talk:Landfish7|<span style="font-family:Tahoma;background:black"><small><font color="yellow">'''fish7'''</font></small></span></span>]]''' 03:52, 2 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Nyahoja/Hogator ==
+Those names were added by {{u|Abcboy}} to the [[List of Japanese Pokémon names]] article. He also stated the source in the edit summary. --'''''[[User:Bfdifan2006|<font color="turquoise">Bfdifan2006!</font>]]''''' <sub>[[User talk:Bfdifan2006|<font color="lime">Or is he actually</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Bfdifan2006|<font color="orange">Keyacom?</font>]]</sub> 06:33, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Primordial chaos ==
+I know the last guy did without permission and stuff but it is its possible to request creation trio be renamed to Primordial chaos with approval and waiting patiently this time if its okay due how I assumed was not done properly? Or is it too late due to again the banned person's stunt? After we have evidence on the official tear given when I added it, it was accepted.--[[User:Jacob9594|Jacob9594 ]] ([[User talk:Jacob9594|talk]]) 14:37, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Trademarked names ==
+I had to revert your edits at the {{p|Overqwil}}, {{p|Ursaluna}}, {{p|Sneasler}} and {{p|Enamorus}} pages because you caused the unofficial Japanese transliteration to only appear in the tooltip for the kana name, which appears as <span style="display: inline-block; border: 1px solid #ccc; text-align: center; min-width: 90px; vertical-align: middle;">'''{{tt|ラブトロス|Rabutorosu}}'''<br>''Romanisation''</span> (in this case, for Enamorus). I think that's rather undesirable. For consistency, it should display as <span style="display: inline-block; border: 1px solid #ccc; text-align: center; min-width: 90px; vertical-align: middle;">'''ラブトロス'''<br>''Rabutorosu''</span> for now. It's always been like this.
+After the official trademarked names are revealed, the kana should have a tooltip for the 1:1 transliteration, and below should be the trademarked Japanese name. --'''''[[User:Bfdifan2006|<font color="turquoise">Bfdifan2006</font>]]''''' <sub>([[User talk:Bfdifan2006|<font color="lime">T</font>]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bfdifan2006|<font color="orange">C</font>]])</sub> 15:50, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Sneasler's leak ==
+I don't know if you guys know this but, a sihoulette of Sneasler climbing a mountain was leaked long before Sneasler was even revealed, so I think that this should be added to its page.[[User:AnnieCat07|AnnieCat07]] ([[User talk:AnnieCat07|talk]]) 16:22, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+== Unblock ==
+You tricked me into editing the creation trio articles by permanently blocking me from doing that. What should I do to get my privileges back? --[[User:SaturnMario|<font color="#034112">SaturnMario</font>]], [[User talk:SaturnMario|<font color="#078325">his talk</font>]] and [[Special:Contributions/SaturnMario|<font color="#83C192">his contributions</font>]] 21:26, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
+:If the block is an indefinite block then you're not likely to get unblocked until you've proven yourself to be a good editor. If you want to suggest an edit I would leave a comment on the talk page of the article. In the mean time, learn from this and just be a good editor, and maybe one day they'll recognize your growth and grant your privileges back. But just asking for your privileges back over and over.. I feel like that isn't going to accomplish much. [[User:Landfish7|<span style="font-family:Tahoma;background:black"><font color="red">'''Land'''</font>]][[User talk:Landfish7|<span style="font-family:Tahoma;background:black"><small><font color="yellow">'''fish7'''</font></small></span></span>]]''' 01:34, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
+::As Landfish stated, you have to prove yourself that you can go to the talk page first and not make largescale edits. I let you edits on the Wii article slide because I thought they were fine, at least. But for the creation trio article, no, that's not going to be that easy.--[[User:Force Fire|<span style="color:#44BAE5">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#85D2EE">orce</span>]][[User talk:Force Fire|<span style="color:#DA7D99">'''F'''</span><span style="color:#E7ABBD">ire</span>]] 05:45, 5 March 2022 (UTC)