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:::::::Just because they're "new" areas, that doesn't mean they will ''always'' be "new" to people. Soon enough, people will know all they feel they need to know from Mirage Forests/etc, and if, at that point, they just want to find a given Pokemon, they shouldn't ''still'' be forced to visit the Mirage Forests/etc page just to figure out which location it is. | :::::::Just because they're "new" areas, that doesn't mean they will ''always'' be "new" to people. Soon enough, people will know all they feel they need to know from Mirage Forests/etc, and if, at that point, they just want to find a given Pokemon, they shouldn't ''still'' be forced to visit the Mirage Forests/etc page just to figure out which location it is. | ||
:::::::People ''can'' remmeber names, but numbers are not—at all—"good" names. Especially when they're never overtly reinforced by the games. If the anime ever wants to do something, we can worry about it then; we don't need to complicate things with what may not be a problem. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 02:22, 17 December 2014 (UTC) | :::::::People ''can'' remmeber names, but numbers are not—at all—"good" names. Especially when they're never overtly reinforced by the games. If the anime ever wants to do something, we can worry about it then; we don't need to complicate things with what may not be a problem. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 02:22, 17 December 2014 (UTC) | ||
::::::::They're certainly better names than "Mirage Mountain northeast of Route 125 but not too far north". What we got is what we got; using both is our best option. But that still leaves the question of what we're going to name the headers. Having just a line underneath that says " This is Mirage Cave 1" would look silly. Do we condense them, "Mirage Island 1 - East of Dewford"? <small>[[User:Glik|glik]]</small><sup>[[User talk:Glik|glak]]</sup> 11:02, 17 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
:::::::::With your above comment, it sounds like you still think that the availability entries would be best written as just "Mirage Island 1" and such. Let me be clear about that: I very much do not like the idea of not giving the explicit location in availability entries. I have no intention of accepting that unless staff should say that's best. Like I said above: you ''don't'' force people to visit a page if they don't need to. | |||
:::::::::I've not said it out, but let me just make it clear what I currently recommend: the availability entries should be edited to things like "Mirage Island (east of Dewford)" (and it's kind of ridiculous to suggest that something like "but not too far north" would need to be included...). That's all. All the rest remains as it is. I don't suggest we use the phrase "Mirage Island 1" ''ever''...I simply don't see any ''real'' need/use for that sort of phrase anywhere. | |||
:::::::::But...if it'll bring an end this debate, I'll accept changing the headers to "Mirage Island 1 - east of Dewford" and the like; maybe add an explanation somewhere that the numbers represent the order of the internal location indices (and maybe that the guide book uses that naming, though that comes off like the bad kind of trivia to me). Besides that, I don't know of anything else that would be remotely useful. (If you want to use the full section header in availability entries, fine I guess, if a bit pointless.) The only complaint I have with this is that it puts the locations in (from a usability standpoint) an arbitrary order, as opposed to the current route progression. I don't like it, but I'd just like to solve this more. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 15:22, 17 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
{{indent}}Using "Mirage spot #" no more ''forces'' people to look at the page than all the B2W2 entries that say "Hidden Grotto"; if you don't know what it's referring to, you have to look at the page. "but not too far north" was an exaggeration to point out that the directions are inexact. With a 360° camera and no form of compass, the difference between north and northeast becomes hard to tell. And keeping to the loop-de-loop of the routes for something that isn't limited to it seems more arbitrary; a clockwise rotation would be better from a usability standpoint. <small>[[User:Glik|glik]]</small><sup>[[User talk:Glik|glak]]</sup> 01:54, 18 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
:The directions of north of ''location'' or northeast of ''location'' aren't too confusing. There is a map on the bottom screen with an arrow that represents the player and which way they are facing. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 02:03, 18 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
::Glik, you say that "if you don't know what it's referring to, you have to look at the page". This is very true. It's true of anything. There is, simply, no getting around that circumstance. That's why I didn't even think it worth mentioning. | |||
::But what about once you do know the basics? If you know what Mirage spots are, you certainly don't "need" to visit the Mirage Islands page to know what they are... So if the availability just says "Mirage Island 1" and you don't remember where that's supposed to be (and there's no good reason you should remember)...well, then you're gonna have to visit the Mirage Islands page for the ''sole purpose'' of figuring out where "Mirage Island 1" is—when the availability entry could very easily have just said the location right out. ''That'' should not happen. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 02:21, 18 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
== XY encounter rates == | |||
I've gone and done the X/Y rates, but things like "Drops from ceiling" (swoops down from above, rustling bush, and trash cans are the rest) were not part of the data. When I corrected [[Glittering Cave]], I noticed the percentages you had put in for those ceiling Pokemon. What kinds of numbers did you see that you arrived at those rates? I'm thinking I might like to grind some encounters of my own at some point and combine my results with yours (a larger data set can only be more reliable). (It's probably also best to track levels if you don't. They can give you insight into the internal slots/structure...although we don't really know what that is, in these cases.) [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 22:38, 22 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
:I do agree that a larger pool would be good. If we both go and encounter 50 to 100 each (they are rarer occurrences, the Glittering Cave took me close to an hour and a half to get the "drop from ceiling" rate) I think we can get a more accurate percentage. I can post those numbers here, just give me about a week. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 03:08, 24 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
::I think I'd be real comfortable if we could get 500 total encounters for any combination of area+method. (In part, that's just a nice, round number, though.) If you're only able to give 100, I'll aim for 200-300. ...By the way, are we only talking Glittering Cave? In total, these areas have encounters that weren't in the slot data: | |||
::*[[Reflection Cave]]: ceiling | |||
::*[[Terminus Cave]]: ceiling | |||
::*[[Victory Road (Kalos)]]: sky (swoops), ceiling | |||
::*[[Kalos Route 18]]: bushes | |||
::*[[Kalos Route 6]]: bushes | |||
::*[[Lost Hotel]]: trash cans (I currently have about 100 Pokemon for daily and 50 for weekly) | |||
::*[[Pokémon Village]]: <s>trash cans</s> (only one Pokemon possible = 100%) | |||
::It can certainly take a long time to gather encounters, but I don't know what you mean about "rarity"... That shouldn't be an issue except with the trash cans (where items can also appear). All you really have to do is save in front of an encounter (and their locations are limited/fixed; I mostly know where, if you'd like me to say) and just reset a bunch of times after activating it. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 07:26, 24 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
:::Ok, I can try for 250 encounters. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 18:49, 24 December 2014 (UTC) | |||
::::Ok, so this what I have so far: | |||
::::*Route 6 - Venipede: 201 encounters & Audino: 49 encounters | |||
::::*Route 18 - Durant: 232 encounters & Heatmor: 18 encounters | |||
::::*Reflection Cave - Woobat: 206 encounters & Ferroseed: 44 encounters | |||
::::You can give me the 250 encounters that you got for Terminus Cave, Victory Road, and Lost Hotel and I will average them with my encounters when I get to them. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 00:43, 15 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::::I started some but have been distracted. | |||
:::::*Swoops/{{kal|Victory Road}} — Fearow: 385, Skarmory: 88, Hydreigon: 27 | |||
:::::*[[Lost Hotel]] dailies — Trubbish: 455, Garbodor: 50; Dusk Ball: 179, Escape Rope: 157, Super Repel: 141, HP Up: 90, Iron: 76, Protein: 73, Max Elixir: 34 | |||
:::::The Lost Hotel dailies are probably fine to calculate from that, I just haven't added the rates because I wanted to edit those and the Tuesday trash cans together. I've also got plenty of {{pkmn|Village}} data, but I haven't added ''that'' because I was also thinking to do it at the same time as Lost Hotel (and some of the data between the two places might have parallels)... [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 01:14, 15 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
::::::That's ok. It does make sense to do Lost Hotel and Pokémon Village together. I can get the 500 Victory Road ceiling encounters and add both ceiling and swooping data to the page. Also, if you want, I can get the other 250 encounters for Route 6, Route 18, and Reflection Cave and add the encounter data to their respective pages. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 01:40, 15 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::::::Sure, go ahead and do that. If I decide to grab any data anywhere outside of the Lost Hotel before you've updated any of those pages, I'll post here. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 01:59, 15 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
== Big project request == | |||
Hey Adamws, if you happen to be flexible with time and don't mind extracting information from Colo/XD, can you help with add the descriptions for [[Evolutionary stone|the]] [[In-battle effect item|var]][[Battle item|ious]] [[Berry|items]] [[Vitamin|that]] [[Revive|have]] [[Ether|been]] [[Valuable item|found]] in the games? I know [[mail]] and [[exchangeable item]]s will be a huge hassle though, so we could worry about that later. Thanks in advance! [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#FF1111"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#11BB11"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 02:22, 20 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
:Yeah, I can help out with that. A quick question though, if the item is not obtainable through normal gameplay, do we just leave the obtainable location info for that game blank, or put a note saying "transfer from main series Gen III games"? [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 18:11, 20 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
::Hmm, I guess leaving it blank will be fine. [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 13:40, 21 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::Ok. One more question, do you want me and [[User:Abcboy|Abcboy]] to get the descriptions for [[List of items by index number (Colosseum)|all]] [[List of items by index number (XD)|items]] in the games? [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 01:36, 22 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
::::That would be ideal, yeah. Thanks so much! Additionally, I know I'm troubling you a lot with this, but I'm also curious about what the location data says for a Pokémon from Orre that was brought all the way over to at least the Generation V games (for reference in the [[Poké Transfer]] article). [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 20:39, 22 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
::::::Ok, I'll get on that. As for Orre Pokémon being transferred to Gen IV and V, their location is a Faraway place ("Orre" isn't in the location coding for Gen IV or V). [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 21:18, 22 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
(resetting indent) Just simply "Faraway place" or does it also indicate "after a long travel through time"? [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 21:34, 22 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
:{{tt|Sorry it took so long to get back to you|I had class to go to :)}}, it does indicate "after a long travel through time" after giving the location "Faraway place" and the the level at which it arrived. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 00:00, 23 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
::It's quite all right! Look at the day I'm responding back, haha. Thanks for being patient with me as well! Two questions with regards to Eggs: can they be transferred to Colo/XD and if so, can they be hatched? It'd be great to get a box sprite of the Egg as well! [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 02:39, 28 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::Eggs can not be traded to Colosseum or XD. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 04:22, 28 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
::::Ok! Thanks for your help! [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 01:05, 29 January 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::::Are you sure the location for Orre Pokémon is "[[Faraway place]]" and not "[[Orre|Distant land]]"? I know that Orre Pokémon in Generation IV say "distant land", not "Faraway place". --[[User:Abcboy|Abcboy]] ([[User talk:Abcboy|talk]]) 06:36, 1 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
::::::Yeah it is actually "distant land". Sorry about that. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 07:08, 1 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
:::::::Ahh, ok. Thanks for the clarification. [[User:Ht14|<span style="color:#AB2813"><sup>'''''ht'''''</sup></span>]][[User talk:Ht14|<span style="color:#00A000"><small>''14''</small></span>]] 00:53, 3 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
(resetting indent) Yeah, when I was looking for an Orre Pokémon, I found an Entei that was in a Poké Ball with the location ''Faraway Place'' in my PC box. I assumed it came from Orre, but it was a hacked Pokémon I had received through a trade a few years ago. I was able to find an Orre Pokémon in a different box and confirm that it is ''Distant Land''. Sorry again about that confusion. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 01:21, 3 February 2015 (UTC) | |||
== Fusion Flare and Fusion Bolt == | |||
They do have boosted animation in XY... [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jw-VprljUY here] you can see both boosted and normal. Fusion Bolt stays a little longer in the air and has lightning striking the ground, while Fusion Flare seems to have a pillar of fire. [[User:Eridanus|Eridanus]] ([[User talk:Eridanus|talk]]) 09:24, 1 May 2015 (UTC) | |||
:Ok, thanks for pointing that out. I hadn't noticed the slight difference in the ending and with the time spent in the air. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 20:40, 1 May 2015 (UTC) | |||
== Image signature advice == | |||
If you happen to run into any images in signatures on talk pages, it is best to remove them instead of changing the image links. [[User:Pattyman|<span style="color:orange">Patty</span>]][[User talk:Pattyman|<span style="color:orange">Man</span>]] 03:18, 2 July 2015 (UTC) | |||
:Ok, I'll remember that. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 03:46, 2 July 2015 (UTC) | |||
== Layout maps == | |||
I noticed you have gotten a lot of images from various games, including some layout maps. We are planning on adding interior layouts for the [[Pokémon Fan Club]], [[Battle Tent]]s, and [[Contest Hall]]s. Would it be possible for you to get layout images for any of these areas? I have the ability to only get the maps, and other models, from XYORAS and SMUSUM. '''[[User:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:magenta">Lady</span>]] [[User talk:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:orange">Ariel</span>]]''' 03:00, 5 January 2018 (UTC) | |||
:Yeah, I'll be able to help with that. The Gen I, II, III images will be easy; Gen IV and V I will see what I can do as the map images I got from them were a bit trickier to get. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 05:12, 5 January 2018 (UTC) | |||
::Okay thanks that will be appreciated. '''[[User:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:magenta">Lady</span>]] [[User talk:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:orange">Ariel</span>]]''' 18:49, 5 January 2018 (UTC) | |||
:::I have uploaded the requested images. I wasn't able to get the Contest Hall stage area from DPPt or Pokémon Fan Club interior from B2W2 as they were too big to fit in a single screenshot and my second method didn't work either. I completely forgot about the Pokémon Fan club interior from HGSS; I'll get that as soon as possible and upload it. [[User:Adamws|Adamws]] ([[User talk:Adamws|talk]]) 02:57, 7 January 2018 (UTC) | |||
::::Okay hopefully you can find a way to get those images. I am not sure how possible it will be to get stage images from ORAS, since I have already looked through the maps for XYORAS and SMUSUM and there is no layout maps for the stage area (there is only one Contest Hall entrance, so they might just reuse that and add a few things for the Lilycove one). The way they did the XYORAS maps is beyond stupid, since they placed each strand of grass and each piece of furniture manually on every map. It is likely the contest stage is like the battle area for the Battle Royal Dome, which is just a battle background (something I haven't looked through much, since there hasn't been much need to). '''[[User:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:magenta">Lady</span>]] [[User talk:Lady Ariel|<span style="color:orange">Ariel</span>]]''' 04:13, 7 January 2018 (UTC) | |||