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User talk:Weedle Mchairybug: Difference between revisions
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::A bit late on this one to reply (eh, still less than 6 months), but your talk page comment for Misty's Starmie (which I replied to, but I figured it would be appropriate to go into a bit more detail here) got me to rewatch EP007 in both Japanese and English, and I believe you misremembered Staryu's situation. What Staryu was actually doing when it dived into the water was negating the usage of Stun Spore and Sleep Powder (kind of similar to Natural Cure, but with water rather than switching out), not healing itself, so the argument that Starmie could still regenerate itself in the water doesn't really hold up. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 22:46, 19 November 2023 (UTC) | ::A bit late on this one to reply (eh, still less than 6 months), but your talk page comment for Misty's Starmie (which I replied to, but I figured it would be appropriate to go into a bit more detail here) got me to rewatch EP007 in both Japanese and English, and I believe you misremembered Staryu's situation. What Staryu was actually doing when it dived into the water was negating the usage of Stun Spore and Sleep Powder (kind of similar to Natural Cure, but with water rather than switching out), not healing itself, so the argument that Starmie could still regenerate itself in the water doesn't really hold up. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 22:46, 19 November 2023 (UTC) | ||
:::I didn't actually mention Staryu at all in that argument (my main focus was Starmie, and if anything I didn't even CONSIDER Staryu's earlier dive into the water to alleviate itself of Stun Spore.), and for the record, Starmie's core wasn't even damaged (ie, it didn't crack. The blinking light simply meant it was low on health), which is the only way it won't be able to heal at all barring maybe a Pokemon Center. And even if we were to somehow use that rationale for how it doesn't hold up, Bye Bye Butterfree made it very explicit that Starmie (and presumably Staryu) most certainly can heal itself (and by that, I specifically mean heal its HP back upwards, not simply negating a status effect) when exposed to water, at least as long as its core was intact (there was a scene during Ash, Misty and Brock's confrontation with Team Rocket over the poached Butterfree where James used a sledgehammer on Starmie, landed a direct hit on it and sent it flying into a wall, causing it to slump down in a similar manner to its situation in Waterflowers of Cerulean City, then Misty grabbed a water cannon (presumably from within Team Rocket's hideout) and proceeded to spray a torrent on it, and then it came right back to full strength). And that's not even getting into how Starmie's Pokedex entries back then make it explicit that it can regenerate as long as its core remains intact. [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] ([[User talk:Weedle Mchairybug|talk]]) 09:36, 20 November 2023 (UTC) | :::I didn't actually mention Staryu at all in that argument (my main focus was Starmie, and if anything I didn't even CONSIDER Staryu's earlier dive into the water to alleviate itself of Stun Spore.), and for the record, Starmie's core wasn't even damaged (ie, it didn't crack. The blinking light simply meant it was low on health), which is the only way it won't be able to heal at all barring maybe a Pokemon Center. And even if we were to somehow use that rationale for how it doesn't hold up, Bye Bye Butterfree made it very explicit that Starmie (and presumably Staryu) most certainly can heal itself (and by that, I specifically mean heal its HP back upwards, not simply negating a status effect) when exposed to water, at least as long as its core was intact (there was a scene during Ash, Misty and Brock's confrontation with Team Rocket over the poached Butterfree where James used a sledgehammer on Starmie, landed a direct hit on it and sent it flying into a wall, causing it to slump down in a similar manner to its situation in Waterflowers of Cerulean City, then Misty grabbed a water cannon (presumably from within Team Rocket's hideout) and proceeded to spray a torrent on it, and then it came right back to full strength). And that's not even getting into how Starmie's Pokedex entries back then make it explicit that it can regenerate as long as its core remains intact. [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] ([[User talk:Weedle Mchairybug|talk]]) 09:36, 20 November 2023 (UTC) | ||
::::"''I didn't actually mention Staryu at all in that argument (my main focus was Starmie, and if anything I didn't even CONSIDER Staryu's earlier dive into the water to alleviate itself of Stun Spore.)''" | |||
::::You may not have mentioned Staryu, but [https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=EP007&diff=3592528&oldid=3592393 you stated here that Starmie could recover by jumping into the pool], which is what Staryu did earlier to negate Stun Spore/Sleep Powder, so I don't feel like it was unreasonable for me to assume that you used Staryu as a basis for that. If that's not the case, then I apologize. | |||
::::"''For the record, Starmie's core wasn't even damaged (ie, it didn't crack. The blinking light simply meant it was low on health), which is the only way it won't be able to heal at all barring maybe a Pokemon Center.''" | |||
::::I'm pretty sure my stance from the very beginning was simply that Starmie was in an objectively disadvantageous position. I never mentioned anything about its core cracking. | |||
::::"''And even if we were to somehow use that rationale for how it doesn't hold up, Bye Bye Butterfree made it very explicit that Starmie (and presumably Staryu) most certainly can heal itself (and by that, I specifically mean heal its HP back upwards, not simply negating a status effect) when exposed to water, at least as long as its core was intact (there was a scene during Ash, Misty and Brock's confrontation with Team Rocket over the poached Butterfree where James used a sledgehammer on Starmie, landed a direct hit on it and sent it flying into a wall, causing it to slump down in a similar manner to its situation in Waterflowers of Cerulean City, then Misty grabbed a water cannon (presumably from within Team Rocket's hideout) and proceeded to spray a torrent on it, and then it came right back to full strength).''" | |||
::::Bit of a sidenote, but it was Jessie that used the sledgehammer. As for the rest: I mentioned this on the talk page for Misty's Starmie as well, but I don't think using future episodes is the greatest counterargument. There are many instances of Pokémon displaying a certain trait for the sake of the progression of the episode, only for it to never be used again (which I'm pretty sure is also what happened here as well). | |||
::::"''And that's not even getting into how Starmie's Pokedex entries back then make it explicit that it can regenerate as long as its core remains intact.''" | |||
::::Those are Staryu's Pokédex entries you're thinking of, which is specifically for lost appendages rather than fully healing itself. | |||
::::My main issue with your argument is that it's built too much on theoretical scenarios rather than what was actually presented within the episode itself. Sure, it's true that Starmie didn't "lose", but I never claimed that it did. I only stated that it was in an disadvantageous situation, which was acknowledged within the episode itself. | |||
::::Also, you mentioned earlier that people have called you biased on Serebii, PokeCommunity, and the Bulbagarden forums. I only say this to try to offer some constructive criticism, but if there are three separate communities saying the same thing, I fear that there may be some truth within their words. If your initial talk page post on Misty's Starmie had been something like "Misty didn't really lose since the battle was interrupted, but I agree that it needs to be rewritten", I would completely understand. Instead, your post contained a fairly lengthy paragraph about the exact circumstances of the battle, theoretical ways in which the battle could have progressed, and a comparison to a separate episode. I feel like that's a bit much considering Temari44 only mentioned the Gym battle in a small part of their post. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 11:55, 20 November 2023 (UTC) | |||
== Pokémon == | == Pokémon == | ||
When writing "Pokémon" or "Poké", don't forget to write the "e" as "é". Also, the word "Trainer" is capitalized. --[[User:FinnishPokéFan92|FinnishPokéFan92]] ([[User talk:FinnishPokéFan92|talk]]) 00:06, 2 October 2023 (UTC) | When writing "Pokémon" or "Poké", don't forget to write the "e" as "é". Also, the word "Trainer" is capitalized. --[[User:FinnishPokéFan92|FinnishPokéFan92]] ([[User talk:FinnishPokéFan92|talk]]) 00:06, 2 October 2023 (UTC) | ||