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Talk:Leaf (game): Difference between revisions
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::Kris and Lyra have been confirmed to be separate characters, unlike Ethan, Elio, and Selene. Also except for the figurine, Leaf was never officially used as a name for the character. In addition, as far as I'm aware and can find, the figurine was announced as Leaf, and has yet to actually be released. Something that is announced can easily change once it's released, and also, let's not forget that the announcement came out shortly before Pikachu & Eevee, and at that point we had no confirmation that even Red or Blue were going to appear. She may've initially intended to be named "Leaf" in Pikachu & Eevee, but changed late in development, or the artist who designed the artwork for the figurine, Hitoshi Ariga, was unaware that she was going to be called Green in Pikachu & Eevee (he didn't work on Pikachu & Eevee, so this is possible), calling her Leaf, since that was the fan consensus name for her at that point. Fact of the matter, we don't know ''who'' exactly coined her Leaf, whether it was someone at Game Freak or Kotobukiya.<br /><br />Even so, the staff on Bulbapedia have already made precedence that the games come before any sort of supplementary material, as is the case of Ethan upon release of HGSS, and if there is nothing in the games that indicates a name, excluding internal data, as this varies for some PCs, then supplementary material should be used, as was the case with Elio and Selene. I would expect staff to be consistent on matters like this, as it reflects poorly on them, as they're backtracking on a convention they had already established. If a staff member went, "Much like Ethan in HGSS, Pikachu & Eevee establish that Leaf's official name is Green" there would probably be some people who would disagree with this, much like Ethan, but most of the people here would not be vocal about this as they are now. [[User:Sinjoh|Sinjoh]] ([[User talk:Sinjoh|talk]]) 03:32, 25 December 2018 (UTC) | ::Kris and Lyra have been confirmed to be separate characters, unlike Ethan, Elio, and Selene. Also except for the figurine, Leaf was never officially used as a name for the character. In addition, as far as I'm aware and can find, the figurine was announced as Leaf, and has yet to actually be released. Something that is announced can easily change once it's released, and also, let's not forget that the announcement came out shortly before Pikachu & Eevee, and at that point we had no confirmation that even Red or Blue were going to appear. She may've initially intended to be named "Leaf" in Pikachu & Eevee, but changed late in development, or the artist who designed the artwork for the figurine, Hitoshi Ariga, was unaware that she was going to be called Green in Pikachu & Eevee (he didn't work on Pikachu & Eevee, so this is possible), calling her Leaf, since that was the fan consensus name for her at that point. Fact of the matter, we don't know ''who'' exactly coined her Leaf, whether it was someone at Game Freak or Kotobukiya.<br /><br />Even so, the staff on Bulbapedia have already made precedence that the games come before any sort of supplementary material, as is the case of Ethan upon release of HGSS, and if there is nothing in the games that indicates a name, excluding internal data, as this varies for some PCs, then supplementary material should be used, as was the case with Elio and Selene. I would expect staff to be consistent on matters like this, as it reflects poorly on them, as they're backtracking on a convention they had already established. If a staff member went, "Much like Ethan in HGSS, Pikachu & Eevee establish that Leaf's official name is Green" there would probably be some people who would disagree with this, much like Ethan, but most of the people here would not be vocal about this as they are now. [[User:Sinjoh|Sinjoh]] ([[User talk:Sinjoh|talk]]) 03:32, 25 December 2018 (UTC) | ||
:::For real, somebody's going to have to ask one of the Game Freak higher-ups like Junichi Masuda if they intended for Green from Let's Go Pikachu Eevee and the player character from FRLG to be the same person. At this point, that's the only way we're going to resolve this. --[[User:LavaringX|LavaringX]] ([[User talk:LavaringX|talk]]) 04:22, 19 April 2019 (UTC) | :::For real, somebody's going to have to ask one of the Game Freak higher-ups like Junichi Masuda if they intended for Green from Let's Go Pikachu Eevee and the player character from FRLG to be the same person. At this point, that's the only way we're going to resolve this. --[[User:LavaringX|LavaringX]] ([[User talk:LavaringX|talk]]) 04:22, 19 April 2019 (UTC) | ||
{{indent}}To continue to beat a dead horse, I still, after this time, think we should remove all references to the character being called "Leaf". | |||
We know a couple of things: | |||
* We are currently treating Green from FRLG and Green from LGPE as the same character, as we should continue to do, since we have in the past with character differences between generations with much bigger design changes and functional differences. See Elio, Selene, Blue, etc... | |||
* Green is the name used in LGPE. There is no official name used in FRLG. | |||
** "Leaf" was the name that Kotobukiya used prior to LGPE's release. | |||
*** Kotobukiya figures are not the main games. | |||
* TPCI has [[Ethan (game)|changed character names before]]. The solution was to go with the most recent name. This name change applied retroactively to games before the name change, like this article is currently NOT doing. | |||
* In the past, Bulbapedia has prioritized information in the main games over secondary sources. Currently, this precedent is not being applied here. | |||
* <s>Not that it matters, but this is one of the things that other Pokemon forums make fun of Bulbapedia for-- I've seen this exact debate being used as evidence of Bulbapedia's incompetency on more than one occasion.</s> | |||
The obvious solution is to call Green by her canonical name. Besides, as I mentioned above, the article is incredibly confusing as it stands. The whole Green/Leaf debacle turned what was previously a serviceable article into kind of a jumbled mess, and one of our poorer articles, just because of a difference in name and a minor change in design. --[[User:Celadonkey|<span style="color:#004EA2">cela</span><span style="color:#B60007">donk</span>]] ([[User talk:Celadonkey|talk]]) 01:23, 7 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
== Article Layout == | == Article Layout == | ||
I move to begin the article with a section on the unused Generation I character before segueing into information about Green and Leaf. Any objections? [[User:LavaringX|LavaringX]] ([[User talk:LavaringX|talk]]) 08:07, 5 February 2019 (UTC) | I move to begin the article with a section on the unused Generation I character before segueing into information about Green and Leaf. Any objections? [[User:LavaringX|LavaringX]] ([[User talk:LavaringX|talk]]) 08:07, 5 February 2019 (UTC) | ||