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Talk:Move Reminder: Difference between revisions
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Agreed, Flametix. I just tested it in Gen VI, and the statement is incorrect. (Evolved Magneton into Magnezone, had it forget Tri Attack, then tried to reteach it Tri Attack, but was not able to.) Can someone test it in Gen VII? --[[User:Firepanda|Firepanda]] ([[User talk:Firepanda|talk]]) 12:46, 10 October 2018 (UTC) | Agreed, Flametix. I just tested it in Gen VI, and the statement is incorrect. (Evolved Magneton into Magnezone, had it forget Tri Attack, then tried to reteach it Tri Attack, but was not able to.) Can someone test it in Gen VII? --[[User:Firepanda|Firepanda]] ([[User talk:Firepanda|talk]]) 12:46, 10 October 2018 (UTC) | ||
:In addition to my Ninetales' inability to relearn Icy Wind (which I already mentioned), I just tested that my Butterfree cannot relearn the level-up move Harden (SM), even though it was caught a level 3 Caterpie. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 09:28, 13 October 2018 (UTC) | :In addition to my Ninetales' inability to relearn Icy Wind (which I already mentioned), I just tested that my Butterfree cannot relearn the level-up move Harden (SM), even though it was caught a level 3 Caterpie. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 09:28, 13 October 2018 (UTC) | ||
== Relearning moves known at evolution == | |||
BlueNinjaKoopa [[Special:Diff/2835175|added]] that if a Pokémon knows a move when it evolved, it can relearn this move if it forgets it (even if the move isn't in its normal movepool). The two examples given were Camerupt with Numel's Double-Edge and Raichu with Pikachu's Agility. | |||
I tested Pikachu/Raichu and Agility in Y, Alpha Sapphire, and Moon, and found that in all three cases this does not work. I ensured Pikachu knew Agility, evolved it, then replaced Agility with a TM. When I went to the Move Reminder, Agility was not an option to teach. This was not surprising, as Pokémon only have 4 Move Reminder slots, which are normally taken up by Egg Moves (and other inherited moves) or event moves (although [[DexNav|Hidden Pokémon]] and [[Island Scan]]'s special moves use these too). | |||
BlueNinjaKoopa, if you include some more details about the specific circumstances under which you observed Raichu being able to relearn Agility, it might be possible to identify specifically what the cause was. I apologize for not responding on my talk page when you left me a message there, but I think this is a better place to discuss it. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#A70000">'''Snorlax'''</span>]][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#0000A7">'''Monster'''</span>]] 03:43, 29 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
:I can e-mail you proof that if a Pokemon evolves knowing a move that is exclusive to any of its pre-evolution, then later forgets that move, it can be re-learned. I made a mistake in the name; although I'm sure that if it did evolve knowing Agility it would have access to it, but the actual move is Charm, which is exclusive to Pichu in the evolutionary line. It doesn't get it from breeding. I can send you a picture via e-mail (uploading it here would violate image policy). <font face="Verdana">[[User:Blue Ninjakoopa|<span style="color:blue">BNK</span>]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Blue Ninjakoopa|Talk]]</sup> 04:12, 30 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
:Also, the game I was playing was Ultra Sun, so maybe that is a very recent change to the mechanics. <font face="Verdana">[[User:Blue Ninjakoopa|<span style="color:blue">BNK</span>]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Blue Ninjakoopa|Talk]]</sup> 04:13, 30 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
::Okay, so assuming that your Pichu was bred, if both of Pichu's parents knew Charm, then Pichu would inherit the move Charm due to breeding because it's a level-up move for Pichu. (The move doesn't need to be an Egg Move to be inherited in this way.) In this case, the move is relearnable because Pichu inherited the move from its parents. If Pichu wasn't obtained by breeding, I'm not sure what the cause would be. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#A70000">'''Snorlax'''</span>]][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#0000A7">'''Monster'''</span>]] 04:41, 30 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
:::The Pichu was bred, but neither parent knew Charm. I used a female Pikachu with the Lightning Rod ability and a male Furret imported from Pokemon Silver on the 3DS Virtual Console. How do you explain that? <font face="Verdana">[[User:Blue Ninjakoopa|<span style="color:blue">BNK</span>]]</font><sup>[[User talk:Blue Ninjakoopa|Talk]]</sup> 06:28, 30 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
::::Okay, so it seems that the mechanic is that ANY move a Pokémon knows when it hatches will be relearnable, regardless of how it knows the move (so not only inherited moves). This is actually already mentioned in the article (when it says "any Pokémon hatched in Generation VI onward may also be taught any move it knew when it hatched"), but the article doesn't emphasize that this includes any Level 1 moves the hatched Pokémon may happen to know. | |||
::::In Moon, I bred a Pichu, using two parents that did not know Charm. Because Charm is a Level 1 move for Pichu, it knew it upon hatching. I replaced Charm with a TM move, then evolved Pichu. After evolution I took it to the Move Reminder, and it could relearn Charm, despite the fact that it didn't know the move when it evolved. I tried this in Y, and got the same results. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#A70000">'''Snorlax'''</span>]][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#0000A7">'''Monster'''</span>]] 09:54, 30 June 2019 (UTC) | |||
== Extreme Speed Dragonite == | |||
Dragonite from Virtual Console Crystal transferred to Ultra Moon knew Extreme Speed. I then replaced Extreme Speed with a TM. Extreme Speed is not an option with the move reminder. Is this a special case? {{unsigned|BulbaBoy}} | |||
:The move reminder can only make a Pokémon remember moves it hatched with if they learned the move in generations VI or VII. Also, you should sign your comments with four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>). [[User:Suic12-|Suic]] ([[User talk:Suic12-|talk]]) 22:35, 9 July 2019 (UTC) | |||
== Teachable moves section == | |||
I think it's far less helpful than it could be. (There isn't really a template for this, so instead I'm posting this here directly.) | |||
I'd need to read that whole section to get to know what moves can be relearned, and I need a lot of prior/in-depth knowledge for that. I'm not even sure whether it's mentioning everything there is, or whether it's missing something or is being ambigious/fuzzy. Maybe there's a possibility to structure it better (chronologically? or with headings?), or to just use a table for the main part. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 17:41, 1 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
:I've added an overview table. It does oversimplify things a bit (especially with regards to event distributions, which only flag moves by convention), but the idea is that it's intended as a broad simplification with the details found in the text below. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#A70000">'''Snorlax'''</span>]][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#0000A7">'''Monster'''</span>]] 09:05, 2 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
::That's way better, thanks. (Actually, it makes me understand the structure of the text.) | |||
::Anyway, other "special moves" are not mentioned at all, which makes me wonder whether they're just not relearned, have not been tested, or are case by case? Gen III [[mass outbreak]]s, [[Pokéwalker]], and [[Pokémon Dream World]] come to mind; maybe there's more - I thought there was some list onwiki, but at least I couldn't find it.. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 17:37, 2 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
:::The ability to flag particular moves as relearnable was only added in Gen 6. As a result, special moves a Pokémon knows from earlier generations (like mass outbreaks or the Dream World) cannot be relearnable, just like Pokémon hatched from Eggs or received from events prior to Gen 6 cannot have any relearnable special moves. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#A70000">'''Snorlax'''</span>]][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|<span style="color:#0000A7">'''Monster'''</span>]] 07:40, 4 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
::::A while after I posted my questions, it occured to me that this has to be the case. For what I can tell, they would need to have added a structure that stores relearnable (non-level up) moves to the Pokemon data in Generation VI. And then it occurred to me that this needs to be somewhat dynamic! And while I wondered about how much space that structure may maximally occupy, I remembered [[List of glitches (Generation VIII)#Move Reminder glitches|that glitch]], which seems to be related. I don't know, but maybe there's even some RAM corruption involved when forgeting enough relearnable moves (not sure if there's a detailed explanation of that glitch out somewhere)!? | |||
::::Anyway, I may be trying to test what happens when a hatched Pokémon has more than four Egg moves, for I would assume it can relearn even those it didn't know when it hatched. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 16:10, 4 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
:::::Tested in SwSh, and while the parents had a total of 5 of the offspring's Egg Moves, the hatched Pokémon cannot relearn the fifth move it did not hatch with. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 14:43, 7 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
::::::Yeah, after looking into it, methods appear to be stored separately/differently, and TRs appear to be stored with (a finite amount of) flags. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 16:02, 7 March 2021 (UTC) | |||