View source for Talk:Struggle (move)

== Contest description ==
o_O Why on Earth does Struggle have a Contest description? --Ketsuban

1) There's one template that encompasses both move and contest info. 2) Maybe Struggle just happens to have those statistics in-built anyway? - [[User:Ferret|Ferret]] 19:00, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

That's what was in Meowth's database anyway. I had some discussion with him on how to prove it, and he suggested {{m|Sketch}}ing it - but in light of recent data, that wouldn't work. - [[User:Zhen Lin|振霖]]<sub>[[User talk:Zhen Lin|T]]</sub> 00:37, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Oops, I meant that if you have, say, a Smeargle with only one move, Sketch, and use it, and after using it in the contest, it wouldn't have any PP, so Struggle would be forced next.  But since contests don't use PP, it wouldn't work to do.  --[[User:Meowth346|Meowth346]] 03:36, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Should we mention somewhere that Struggle, despite being Normal, seems to have no problem affecting Ghost Pokémon? [[User:Elsa|Elsa]]
:Probably so. '''[[User:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#FF0000;">T</span>]][[User talk:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#FF0000;">T</span>]][[wp:Echidna|<span style="color:#FF0000;">E</span><span style="color:#0000FF;">chidna</span>]]''' 05:16, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Struggle may have contest data for the same reason that {{p|Arceus}} has a {{t|???}} sprite; so the game wont crash if someone uses a cheating device to force Struggle to be used in a contest. [[User:Bardock|3190]] 11:43, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

== 25% ==

Struggle taks off one quarter of the users HP, regardless of the damage it does. It always has when I have used it. Definately not 50% of the damage it does. <small>[[User:Tesh|<span style="color:#FF594F;">'''TESH'''</span>]]</small><small>[[User Talk:Tesh|<span style="color:#5FA7C6;">'''TALK'''</span>]]</small> 20:53, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Some other Pokémon sites say the same. <small>[[User:Tesh|<span style="color:#FF594F;">'''TESH'''</span>]]</small><small>[[User Talk:Tesh|<span style="color:#5FA7C6;">'''TALK'''</span>]]</small> 23:34, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
:Changed it! XD [[User:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''TESH'''</span>]][[User_talk:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''IGIGAS'''</span>]] 15:10, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

== Type? ==

How do we know the type? Does it affect Ghost-types? Are we assuming it's a Normal-type move just because it is not super effective on anything??? '''[[User:Optimus35|It's the <span class="explain" title="Optimus35"><sc>Θρtιmαtum♏</sc></span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Ph34r4ever|Talk]]|[[User:Optimus35/sig/Pikachu|Links]]</sup>''07:21 18 Jun 2008'''''
:In the game data. Same as for the contest stats. '''[[User:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#FF0000">''TTE''</span>]][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 07:24, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
::It's just a filler type I'm guessing. It's obviously not a true Normal type. It's only there to stop game crashes. [[User:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''TESH'''</span>]][[User_talk:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''IGIGAS'''</span>]] 14:08, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
:::Aw, I was thinking about it and felt the need to look it up because I hoped it had the ??? type, that would make more sense but I guess since Struggle predates the ??? type they probably wouldn't have felt the need to change it to that, but it would make sense to have it be ??? type. [[User:Felinoel|felinoel]] 02:56, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

== Wobbuffet! ==

Does anyone have an image of '''Wobbuffet!''' using this attack? It was in the anime so I'm thinking we should puut a note in. [[User:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''TESH'''</span>]][[User_talk:Tesh|<span style="color:#B7AD96;">'''IGIGAS'''</span>]] 14:10, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
::If this is true, then the last piece of trivia is wrong. For some reason, I also remember Wobbuffet using Struggle.... [[User:Kookamooka|Kookamooka]] 15:52, 12 May 2012 (UTC)
:::This is true. If it isn't than the other languages section should not contain Dutch, Greek or Serbian, as they never had a main game translation, just anime dubs...[[User:Insert Pokè-name|Insert Pokè-name]] ([[User talk:Insert Pokè-name|talk]]) 21:38, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

== All? ==

Does Struggle take 25% of the user's HP even if it has an ability like [[Rock Head]]?
[[User:FireHazard|Slash!!]] 11:53, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
:Yes, it does. '''[[User:Hfc2x|<span style="color:#008800">h</span><span style="color:#000000">fc</span>]][[User talk:Hfc2x|<span style="color:#000000">2</span><span style="color:#008800">X</span>]]''' 15:29, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
== STAB ==
Is [[STAB]] applied to this move?[[User:Kkllnn|Blastoise RULZ]] 19:11, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
:That's a good question. I'd imagine not, since Rock Head and a host of other things don't. They likely didn't make it ???-type just because of the fact that ??? moves do barely anything. '''[[User:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#FF0000">''TTE''</span>]][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 20:14, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

== Blissey ==

I noted that Blissey doesn't take 25% of the damage it does with struggle... it instead takes something like 2500%. Anyone noted it? '''[[User:Hfc2x|<span style="color:#008800">h</span><span style="color:#000000">fc</span>]][[User talk:Hfc2x|<span style="color:#000000">2</span><span style="color:#008800">X</span>]]''' 00:26, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
:That's because it's not 25% of the damage caused (if it was, Blissey would probably take less than 3 damage per use). It's 25% of the user's maximum HP. [[User:Diachronos|Diachronos]] 16:16, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

== Wait. ==

What if a Smeargle used Sketch after the opponent used Struggle?! '''[[User:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#FF0000">''TTE''</span>]][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 09:55, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
:No, Struggle can't be learnt by Smeargle because it cant accually by "learnt" by any Pokémon. It just a replacement for when you've run out of options in a battle. The move will just fail. -- [[User:Clarky13|<span style="color:#0000FF;">'''Clarky'''</span>]][[User talk:Clarky13|<span style="color:#000000;">'''13'''</span>]] 10:47, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

== When used on Kecleon? ==

Makes it Normal again, or no? '''[[User:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#DAA520">''TTE''</span>]][[User talk:TTEchidna|<span style="color:#C0C0C0">chidna</span>]]''' 07:11, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

== Mewtwo Strikes Back ==

In the final battle at the end, is this what the Pokemon are using? It seems that they are hurting themselves by attacking and Mewtwo notes that he is supressing their abilities (which could be understood to mean attacks, as 'Abilities' hadn't been introduced by that point). If so should this be noted on the page? {{unsigned|DrStubbsberg}}
It's possible.--[[User:Mtn otter|Mtn otter]] 20:03, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

== Normal-type? ==

If it hits all Pokémon with 1x effectiveness, including Ghost wouldn't that make it {{type|???}}? <span style="color:#91A3B0">—</span>[[User:Venomoth|<span style="color:black; font-size: 13pt">'''''V'''e<small>№</small>moth''</span>]][[User talk:Venomoth| ♦]] 08:00, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
:The info listed in the article is only what the game says it is, I once changed the amount of PP to the infinity symbol to find someone change it back and tell me this, you ''can'' mention that in a bit of trivia though, would also make a nice addition to the ???-type page, but be sure to state that it '''only''' ''acts as'' the ???-type [[User:Felinoel|felinoel]] 04:57, 31 January 2011 (UTC)
::I tested it on a beldum (a steel type) and it wasn't very effective. Hope this helps. [[User:S and T|S and T]] 01:26, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

==PP?==
How come it says in the article that it has 10 base PP, then in the table it says 1? [[User:Juzey|<span style="color:purple">Juzey</span>]][[Shaymin (Pokémon)|<span style="color:purple">!!</span>]] <small>''([[User talk:Juzey|<span style="color:orange">Talk</span>]])''</small> 10:03, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
:Read the following section. <span class="sc">[[User:Werdnae|<span style="color:#2D4B98;">Werdnae</span>]]</span> <small>[[User talk:Werdnae|<span style="color:#009000;">(talk)</span>]]</small> 22:49, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

== Mirror? ==

Out of curiosity, can Struggle be imitated by an opponent knowing {{m|Mirror Move}} or {{m|Me First}}? --''[[User:Stratelier|Stratelier]] 19:55, 27 February 2011 (UTC)''
:No, the move would fail. [[User:Pikiwyn|<font color="#d0000d" face="chiller">'''Pikiwyn'''</font>]] [[User talk:Pikiwyn|<tt><sup>'''''<font color="black">talk</font>'''''</sup></tt>]] 20:22, 27 February 2011 (UTC)

== Still typeless? ==

Since the abolition of the ???-type and Future Sight and Doom Desire's inability to deal typeless damage, is this still typeless?

Also, we should REALLY test on Kecleon in all gens with Kecleon in it. [[User:TorchicBlaziken|TorchicBlaziken]] <sup>([[User_talk:TorchicBlaziken|talk]]•[[Special:Contributions/TorchicBlaziken|edits]])</sup> 00:30, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

== Rough Skin / Rocky Helmet / Static / Et.c. ==

It's a contact move, so deserves a mention either way, no? [[User:PLA|PLA]] 11:01, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

== In other generations ==

The picture in this section of Generation III doesn't actually depict this move being used. Anyone have a better one? [[User:Jordan042|Jordan042]] 18:17, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
:What are you on about? Yes it does. ☆<span style="font-family:Algerian">[[User:Solar Dragon|<span style="color:green">The</span>]] [[User talk:Solar Dragon|<span style="color:red">Solar</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Solar Dragon|<span style="color:blue">Dragon</span>]]</span>☆ 18:27, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
::The animation is done incorrectly. The first frame of the animation '''must''' be mid-move so that people using browsers which don't display animated png images can see the move. People who are using browsers that do can check it on the image page - the history list doesn't show animation. <span class="sc">[[User:Werdnae|<span style="color:#2D4B98;">Werdnae</span>]]</span> <small>[[User talk:Werdnae|<span style="color:#009000;">(talk)</span>]]</small> 19:58, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
:::Pardon me, but why not just use gifs?  They're animated in all browsers, wouldn't that be better?  <small>- ''unsigned comment from [[User:Missingno. Master|Missingno. Master]] ([[User talk:Missingno. Master|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Missingno._Master|contribs]])'' </small> 11:22, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

== Ditto ==

In Red Version, my Ditto seems unable to use Struggle unless it has Transformed.  If I start a battle out with no PP left for Transform, and select Fight, it goes to the move list as usual instead of automatically inputting Struggle for my attack that round.  Selecting Transform just gives back the message, "No PP left for this move!"  Running out of PP while Ditto is already Transformed allows me to use Struggle normally.  Has anyone else encountered this problem?  Is it interesting enough to warrant adding here? —[[User:Doctorlit|doctorlit]] 01:17, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

== Description? ==

Anyone got any modified Pokemon that has this move as a standard move at all? Would be helpful for getting down a description on this page. Thanks. ''[[User:Frozen Fennec|<span style="color:teal">Frozen</span>]] [[User talk:Frozen Fennec|<span style="color:green">Fennec</span>]]'' 16:43, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

== The Ability Rock Head ==

what if a Pokemon has the ability rock head will it still take damage?--[[User:Hydra3dragon|Hydra3dragon]] ([[User talk:Hydra3dragon|talk]]) 05:17, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

== Critical Hit ==

Should it be noted that Struggle can score a critical hit, despite what you would expect from a last-ditch move?
[[User:Takaoldaria|Takaoldaria]] ([[User talk:Takaoldaria|talk]]) 08:47, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

== Glitch Pokemon ==

Should it be noted that most glitch Pokemon, such as 4, ゥァ (DD), can learn this move? [[User:BisumitoIsSnazzy|q~Bisumito Is Snazzy~p]] ([[User talk:BisumitoIsSnazzy|Talk~]]) 16:41, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

:Before someone deletes this and tells me off for responding to an old statement, I was about to ask something vaguely related anyway, and this is quicker and more convenient than starting a new section... (And it's also the most recent question, and thus my question isn't going to be buried by replying to an old question.) Can Pokemon even be obtained at Levels above 100 with the Johto Guard Glitch? The latter two glitch Pokemon learn Struggle above Level 100. (At level 205, to be exact.) Which, if they're not, in fact, obtainable via the Johto Guard Glitch, would render that portion incorrect. (As you couldn't obtain an over-Level 100 Pokemon that way without cheating.) Correct me if I'm wrong or there's some glitch that can enable non-Level 101+ Pokemon to become over Level 100 or something. Though, I'm not even sure that trivia point should be listed, it's not like they do it for signature moves or anything else, aside from like height/weight. [[User:RiverShock|RiverShock]] ([[User talk:RiverShock|talk]]) 09:09, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

== Magic Guard ==

Since the Ability [[Magic Guard (Ability)|Magic Guard]] does not prevent Struggle's recoil damage, would it be worth mentioning here? [[User:Pikakirby|Pikakirby]] ([[User talk:Pikakirby|talk]]) 18:07, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

== Trivia ==

In the trivia, it states that Leech Seed has never been featured in the anime. This, however, is incorrect. Ash's Bulbasaur has used Leech Seed multiple times, namely in the original series. This is specifically stated in the page titled, "Ash's Bulbasaur." [[User:Mattakash|Mattakash]] ([[User talk:Mattakash|talk]]) 18:07, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
:It mentions Leech Life, not Leech Seed.  --[[User:Funktastic~!|<span style="color:#009900">'''It's'''</span> <span style="color:#CC66FF">'''Funktastic~!'''</span>]][[User talk:Funktastic~!|<sub><small><span style="color:#99CCFF">''話してください''</span></small></sub>]] 18:10, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

== Struggle + Sturdy? ==

Okay, this is a really weird (and mostly theoretical) question, but under just the right circumstances can Struggle break through {{a|Sturdy}} and cause a one-hit knockout? --''[[User:Stratelier|Stratelier]]'' 19:36, 30 March 2014 (UTC)
:Sturdy only applies when the Pokémon has full health. So the only Pokémon that is guaranteed to knock itself out with Struggle would be Shedinja, and I believe iirc that it will survive with Sturdy as its ability. (You can legitimately get a Shedinja with Sturdy with HA Carbink w/ Skill Swap.) <sup>[[Typhlosion (Pokémon)|<span style="color:#C00;">★</span>]]</sup>[[User:Jo The Marten|<span style="color:#C00;">Jo the Marten</span>]]<sup>[[Flygon (Pokémon)|<span style="color:#C00;">★</span>]]</sup> [[User_Talk:Jo The Marten|<span style="color:#C00;">ಠ_ಠ</span>]][[Cilan (anime)|<span style="color:#90C870;">♥</span>]] 19:42, 30 March 2014 (UTC)
::I'd say that should be tested. Struggle says recoil-preventing Abilities don't stop Struggle's "recoil", and Sturdy says that it doesn't prevent a Pokemon from knocking itself out with recoil damage. I'd imagine Shedinja would KO itself if it used Struggle while it had Sturdy. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 19:50, 30 March 2014 (UTC)
:::Maybe test it by having Shedinja use a recoil move that it does know? {{unsigned|StrongRadd}}
::::For anyone actually intending to test it, I looked it up, and Shedinja's only recoil move (other than Struggle) is Double-Edge, which it gets only from FRLG/E/XD move tutors. [[User:Pumpkinking0192|Pumpkinking0192]] ([[User talk:Pumpkinking0192|talk]]) 05:21, 20 May 2014 (UTC)